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Gallup: Mitt 24 Newt 23 Paul 13

The national numbers just totally don't suggest that Romney is wrapping this up.  He's never gotten outside the margin of error ahead of Newt.  Is it a coincidence that the only candidate in the field who has not surged as the Anti-Romney is Huntsman?  If Paul or Santorum win tonight, not good for Romney.  Failing to overtake Newt means that Newt will rise again in the South.  Get some popcorn, folks, this is just getting started.

Read the full article at http://www.gallup.com/poll/election.aspx

 Is it a coincidence that the only candidate in the field who has not surged as the Anti-Romney is Huntsman?

As a valley girl would say: duh. GOP primary voters do not want a moderate, they want a conservative. Mitt is no good at hiding his general election qualities for primary purposes, partly because of inherent personality defects and partly because he has a more well known public record. Huntsman, on the other hand, has never been interested in playing a conservative.

I don't discount what you're saying (because I think it's absolutely correct), but I also wonder if the Mormon question doesn't weigh in.

Governors of Utah tend to be conservative.  But yes, he has run toward the center.  The Mormon thing has something to do with it too, no question.

FWIW I wonder how many GOP voters watched HBO's Big Love (probably not a lot, but still.) I think the writers pondered the Mormon relationship with conservative politics a great deal. But they made it into a narrative about a modern polygamist Mormon vs mainstream Mormons not accepting him. Bill Henricksen politically was like halfway between Romney and the anti-Romney's. He was most certainly a hard work self-made man and family values guy right out of Moral Majority, a hardware megastore owner competing with the big corporations. It's just that his type of family wasn't acceptable to "real" Mormons. He won his election to the statehouse based on his politics but in the end was castrated in achieving anything by no one in the statehouse wanting to have anything to do with him and even some plotting against him. Come to think of it, the writers did depict mainstream Mormonism as very corporatist-like, and to them it was Bill who was the cultist.

We need you to blog this. Mitt v Bill: Whose Love For Our Nation Is Bigger? Or any zingy title you like. My dad is a Republican and he, like me, watched it all.

Oh geez, that show was so rich in analogy and metaphoric material once you got into it that it could be the spawn of 10,000 blog/essay ideas, but not a single one of those not an onerous chore to write. Not to say that it was great art, but like a lot of great art, it's was like this: better not verbalizing about it, the message is most clear in image language, not written language. That's why artists are lousy at describing their art.

How about that ending, though? (That's like "how about them Packers?") Matriarchy may be the solution to our troubles! Bill foresaw it with his dying breath! cheeky

He's seen as even more moderate than Romney, because he 1) accepted an ambassadorship from Obama and 2) has openly denounced crazy right-wing shibboleths, like the idea that global warming is a hoax. It's not enough to be conservative. A candidate has to renounce common sense entirely.

If anything, Huntsman is seen as the extra-Romney.

The ambassadorship was his doubling-down on postpartisanship, which is not tres successful of a bring in the GOP primaries. 

I like your turn of phrase and will tweak it.  He's the Hyper-Romney.

Thanks, Hyper-Romney is better. (Perhaps uber-Romney?)

The ultra Romney?

After all, he rides a motorcycle through the desert, not a station wagon fill of kids and with a dog tied on top cheeky

Thinking on that, I recall that he tried that western loner thing via Hollywood early on, i.e. Ronald Reagan on his horse, i.e. Marlboro Man. Didn't seem to appeal much at all. I suspect maybe that, like with Ronnie, you have to have some bonafide history ranting about commies and socialists and welfare queens first? You can't be any old cowboy?

I think "ultra-Romney" is the best. It sounds just enough like "anti-Romney" to make it clear that it's meant as the opposite of that term.

The only candidate in the field other than Roemer and Johnson, I assume you mean?

 

We'll see how tonight goes. But national numbers aren't the whole story. As Nate Silver pointed out today, most GOP voters haven't just been treated to three weeks of blistering anti-Gingrich attack ads, the way people in Iowa have. So I expect Newt to underperform his national numbers.

And yes, in this case, the unrepresentative caucus voters are a better indicator than the national trend. Because if those attack ads beat Newt in Iowa, they will go on TV everywhere else he tries to campaign.  The national numbers are the weekly AP poll rankings; Iowa is the first game of the season.

President Huckabee showed us the power of the opening game. I don't like the AP analogy because it implies Mitt would be expected to win in Ca'lina. Fushizzle that.

First game of the season is also a misleading indicator that people put too much stock in. But it gives you a different kind of information than pre-season rankings.

President Huckabee, President Santorum.  Field of Dreams indeed.

And of course, President Obama.

Iowa was one of three decisive moments, each of which to me receives roughly equal weight in that story:  Iowa, South Carolina, Super Tuesday.  But yes, that.  I remember how big that night was.  I was sitting on my bed drinking wine, and that night was a big deal.  Santorum?  Less so.  Or is it the historic first time a neologism wins a Presidential caucus?

Look, I'd never say that Iowa was a good predictor of the nominee. But it can be a place where your campaign weaknesses get exposed, and your opponents see how to beat you. I surely don't expect Santorum or Paul to be accepting the nomination in August.

But if TV ads can knock Gingrich's numbers down 15 or 20 points below where he polls nationally, that means something. It means those national poll numbers can be knocked down if someone spends the TV money. And, as an aside, that Gingrich has only a slightly better campaign organization than most people who aren't running.

Will respond in a bit.  Very sound comment, but I see it a bit differently.

Most rational analysis. This isn't a national contest ... I still don't understand what people think they are looking at with a national data point.

I think it's far more interesting that both Gingrich and Paul have given up serious numbers to Romney in NH - Romney showing weakness there was one of the original premises of Gingrich success, and it doesn't seem to be happening. Santorum is reportedly going to make a play there ... while Perry and Bachmann move right to South Carolina along with Gingrich. So, we're going to start seeing some legit polling on South Carolina 'prolly around the start of next week.

It's game on time.

I can tell you what I am looking at with a national data point - a base line.  Generally speaking you don't have someone scoring 4% in the national polls going on to win many states.  Once you have the baseline you can start to look at the specific demographics in a particular state. So Romney having 38% in NH makes sense at this stage given he has 24% in the national poll.  But in SC where there is stronger right wing Christian constituency, that 24% is likely to sink to 17%. 

When Newt surged in Iowa there was a corresponding surge nationally.  Ron Paul's rise in Iowa also is represented in the national polls. Even for Santorum there has been a bump in the national baseline.

And I can say I never based my Gingrich success on him cutting into Romney's numbers in NH.  It has been based on his ability to take SC, and then to leverage that into a victory or a close second in Florida.

And Bachmann most likely will drop out after her Iowa showing, so she won't be in SC or NH.  None of those voters will go Romney.  The Christians will go to Santorum, the tea party folks to Newt.

That's an interesting approach. Movement in a state should logically result in a correlating movement in national poll numbers, no? That's how math works. Still don't understand how you're coercing a that number into a valid baseline for any specific state contest.

FWIW, I don't know of any professional data/stats people who put stock in that number or base their race analysis on it. For example, Nate Silver specifically doesn't integrate national polling data into crafting his probability models.

My understanding is it's pretty much a narrative poll for the purpose of giving talking heads something to talk about ... helps the media to trivially turn a rather complex dance into the simple "who's on top" horse race narrative they love so well.

I misrememberd the case made in favor of Newt ... Iowa was supposed to anoint him the new front-runner, don't know where I pulled that bit about NH from.

And let's remember that McCain who received only 17% of the vote in 2008 caucus, yet at the Iowa state convention in June was allocated all of the delegates.

Another thing to remember, participants in the Iowa caucus represent about 3% to 4% of the population, so the results is not exactly indicative of how candidates will fare in the primaries where there is more participation.  National polls can be a way of balancing an outcome in Iowa to understand where the GOP electorate actually stands.

Rick (23), Mitt (23), and Ron (23) tied up in a three way totaling 69.

JC Watts is on MSNBC saying that Mitt has a ceiling at 23.  JC is right.  Watts:  "Maybe that's the moderate count in the Republican base.  There has been no Romney surge.  You've got 75% of Republicans saying he's not our choice."

Maddow:  Paul getting 21% of the self-identified born-again Christians, largely on the basis of strong and clear antiabortion messaging.

Damn. JC Watts talking sense. And I have to give him credit for it.

tied up in a three way totaling 69.

And Bachmann, as usual, just watching from one side.

Some are reporting that some within her staff are advising her to drop out now.

I can't stand Tweety or Sharpton, so I've been watching the coverage on Current TV, with Cenk Uygur, Fmr Gov Jennifer Granholm and Fmr VP Al Gore. They think Iowa picked a loser: Michele Bachman, but that the winners are not helped that much.

Perry is not necessarily a loser, according to Gore, because he still has a lot of money to spend. Gingrich probably can't win now, says Gore, but still has a lot to say. Romney couldn't break his ceiling, Paul came in third and Santorum is just the evangelical's current darling.

Gore thinks the big winner tonight was Barack Obama.

I also occasionally switched to Tennis Channel and watched Djokovic slaughter Federer 6-2, 6-1 in Mubadala.

Amen.

I think that we're seeing that Romney's ceiling is pretty firm. It's not just that only 23-24% of primary voters want him as first choice. It's that under a quarter of the voters are willing to vote for him no matter how bad the rest of the field gets.

What happens if nobody breaks a 25 percent ceiling? Is it like a poker hand where no one hits the minimum?

I don't think anybody knows. But it means that you can't really call anyone a front-runner. And it leaves the door open for much more weirdness.

Blog almost up.

Oh my ... the first contest and we already have a meme ....

THIS IS EXCELLENT NEWS FOR OBAMA!

 

It is time to dust that one off, I think! laugh

Here's what the Wall Street Journal had to say:

When former Sen. Bob Dole won Iowa in 1996, his 26% showing was the lowest winning percentage in caucus history. Turnout, meanwhile, was similar to four years ago, defying expectations that Iowa Republicans would turn out in huge numbers.

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